Hesitation/miss-fire Help Please running out of time!

Juggs

Member
Right i have had a slight misfire on my R for a little while now, only really noticed it on part throttle holding it at say 2k rpm etc.
It wasn't really bad and always cleared at WOT so didn't worry too much no hesitation under load & drove fine bar a little hick-up at low revs.
It just used to burp & sound like unburnt fuel igniting.
Thought it was about time i looked into it so started renewing parts to see if i could solve it.
Changed my plugs to a set of NGK BCR8's and it made no difference (from BCR7es)

Then one night after getting a little bit too enthusiastic playing with an m3 i started to get bad hesitation problems, my car was fine at the time but not long afterwards it seemed to be holding back and the little miss had became a whole lot more apparent so nursed the car home to look further.

I did a compression test fearing the worst i got: 150psi, 153psi, 151psi, 150psi which i have been told is a good reading is this correct?
Also looked at tops of the pistons which are standard & couldn't see any pitting etc.
Checked plugs which have no damage, re gapped them to 0.8 as they where a bit out but this didn't cure the problem.
Since then i have changed the Dizzy cap & rotor arm driving it after both but it still hesitates.

I have done a fault code check and it pulls up all clear with a 55 every time.

Tried moving the dizzy which made no difference so put it back to the original markings as i thought maybe it had moved.

Also me & a friend shimmed the head as it through a rocker arm last year and the valve clearances were miles out, quietened the head but made no difference to my fault.

Cant seem to see any boost leaks, checked the turbo for shaft play & it seems ok, also pulled the pipe of the waste gate to see if it was sticking & it boosted all the way up to 1.3 bar then i let off.

Cant see any petrol leaks around the injectors, ran cotton buds around them as i thought this would pick up if the o-rings are leaking or is this not a good method?
Took off H.T leads & inspected them & sprayed with contact cleaner as i could see not visible damage or hear them arcing.

The car is the usual 1 bar mong spec, so has a front mount, walbro, mongoose etc.
It is always run on 99 octane or if not its 97 so doubt its crappy fuel.

Had the same sort of symptoms before but with less of a misfire but it threw code 34 so changed the det sensor which solved it last year.

As a side note the problem seems more apparent when the car gets up to full running temp, never noticed it before as i don't drive the car hard until its warm but to test it i did the other night and the miss on part throttle was still there but it didn't seem to hesitate anywhere near as bad & pulled a lot harder.

Symptoms are: Hesitation through the rev range at WOT, almost seems to surge on & off power,
Generally a lot slower/less power & seems to take longer to build boost,
Misfire when held at part throttle,
Exhaust note seems to have changed (deeper mismatched tone)
Hesitation seems worse when the car is warm


Any input would be great as this is driving me mad & i need to get it sorted asap as i am booked up to go to the ring in it next month so im getting a bit worried! :-O
 
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Fast Guy

Moderators
Staff member
Are your turbo and manifold bolts tight? The can come undone.
Is it running rich?
Could you have done any other damage when you threw the rocker? Bent valve for example.
Did you do the shims correctly?
 

Juggs

Member
Thats a thought actually as i tightened them when i brought the car about a year & a half ago as they where finger tight but i will re-check them today.

I think it is as it seems to pop & bang more than it did before this fault developed, i have a wideband uego that i want to get fitted to monitor the AFR's.
Would it be ok to get this fitted into the de-cat pipe or does it need to be closer up the system?

I did question myself on that if it had done any damage when it threw a rocker but that was last year & i have done a few hundred miles since so surely this would of been an issue as soon as i put the rocker arm back on?

The shims i presume i done correctly as i got them as close as possible as the cold tolerances in a guide posted on here, also the bad hesitation issue & miss where both their before we done the shims. Admittedly only a couple of days later though, but didn't think that would explain why it got worse the warmer the car gets?
 
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pulsarboby

Guest
i just replied with an in depth list to check but bloody computer shut down and cant be assed to type it all again so give me a bell and il explain if you like
 

Juggs

Member
What basic electrical tests do you mean?
As in the battery charge & if it changes when running etc to prove the alternator etc?

Ed if i can borrow a decent fuel gauge off of someone i will check this out as it crossed my mind to, i take it i fit it just before the fuel rail?
What would be the sort of pressure i am looking for at idle?
 

keastygtir

Well-Known Member
If its was a low down the range misfire that was clearing on WOT throttle its very likely to be electrical i.e plugs leads dizzy coil etc as the above posts suggest
 
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Fusion Ed

Active Member
3bar with disconnected vac line. and car idling. If you block the return pipe the fuel pressure should rise to 5+bar min. also put a tube on the reg and use a bike pump or something to ass pressure and the fuel pressure should go up too.
 

Juggs

Member
Just wanted to say thanks for all the replies & advice, i wasn't just being ignorant and not replying or trying any of the suggestions its just i seem to have a much bigger problems with my car now.

Lost oil pressure at 7k due to oil pump failure so a little misfire has taken a back seat to a knocking bottom end, gutted!
Thanks for the help though.
 

Juggs

Member
If i am honest it is an assumption, worded it incorrectly i suppose its an oil pressure problem.

Oil temp went off the gauge hot and oil pressure went to zero then the car de-accelerated rapidly and then started making an awful knocking noise after a prolonged period at high rpm and under full load so i kind of guessed the worst has happened & it rattled the bottom end.

Car struggled to turn over, fired up and drove a few more yards as i was close to an exit then i dipped the clutch as it stalled.

Cant see any obvious oil leaks anywhere, i will pull the plugs out tomorrow and see if it turns over by hand.
Does this sound like a bottom end failure of some sort or is their a way to check before i jump at getting a new engine?
 

Fusion Ed

Active Member
You've cooked it. Oil pressure was a symptom, not the cause. However from the posts above something clearly was very wrong with the way that car was setup.
 

Juggs

Member
No it didnt sound good to me either, had fitted an Aem wideband that day & got a bit carried away watching that to check the AFR's where to far out.
Think i will be fitting a decent mechanical oil pressure gauge to my next one & paying more attention to it!

Just out of interest even though the engine is now goosed, i was getting as a rough guide these afr's are they far away from the norm:

Idle: 14.6-15.2
Part throttle: around 14.2-15.6
Under WOT from 2500-6000rpm: around 12.1-13.2
WOT 6000rpm onwards: around 11.5-10.8
 

Juggs

Member
No it didnt sound good to me either, had fitted an Aem wideband that day & got a bit carried away watching that to check the AFR's where to far out.
Think i will be fitting a decent mechanical oil pressure gauge to my next one & paying more attention to it!

Just out of interest even though the engine is now goosed, i was getting as a rough guide these afr's are they far away from the norm:

Idle: 14.6-15.2
Part throttle: around 14.2-15.6
Under WOT from 2500-6000rpm: around 12.1-13.2
WOT 6000rpm onwards: around 11.5-10.8
 
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pulsarboby

Guest
as said yesterday I would say that's slightly to lean on boost but not that far out

if the engine was knocking as you said on phone yesterday then the cars span a shell and bottom end will be goosed along with your oil pump. as to what caused it......well could be a number of things which you need to diagnose once you have fitted another engine to avoid same thing happening again.

btw I will have a good engine in if you not got one yet, all tested and still in car running if you want to hear it
 

Juggs

Member
Just as a quick update for anyone interested i managed to source another engine and get it fitted before i went to the ring.
i took a chance on a low milage engine which was apparently running fine when removed from a breaker,
Got my old one out & swapped everything over as it was a bare block & got it running fine.
On route from birmingham i got as far as the M25 only for the same thing to happen on the way there so i was a little miffed to say the least but i suppose thats the risk you run buying a second hand engine.
Now hope to get them stripped down and make two decent engines from two dead ones
 
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