i have these fitted , yes they do take some warming but if you have the discs to go with them they are pretty good, they take alot of abuse before they fade so good, if like me you are hard on your brakes. A vast improvement over the standard ones, who ever said they arent much better than standard obviously doesnt drive hard enough, but i agree not as good as a willwood or hi-spec kit but if like me and you have a trade account red stuff pads and grooved discs only cost £200 total(pads were only £39) much cheaper.