Maybe Good Idea

[pulsarboby]

I maybe talking out my butthole here but i think ive just maybe had a good idea, or food for thought anyway lol

someone showed a photo of a car for sale on ebay the other day that had a so called hks charge cooler fitted (to me it looked like a bodged up diy jobbie) but this has led me to my idea!

rather than bin the aircon system and the topmount intercooler why not run some microbore copper pipe around the topmount or indeed a frontmount ic as a coil effect directly plumbed into the ac system ie flow & return???
you will then have ice cold piping and cooling for your ic 8) this could be done for around £30

 

[Trip]

That idea went into my mind too but remember that the extra bhp you will get from the colder air, will be sucked from the A/C compressor.

There are other scenario to get cold air but all have their losses in some way or another.. Another possibility would be to jacket the standard IC the same way and filling it up with liquid. Stick some Peltier on it and let it freeze the liquid. The down side is that the peltier draw loads and loads of current and will drain battery and probably fry the alternator.

the best i thought would to use C02 in a closed jacket (like above) and venting it out far away from the air intake.

 

[pulsarboby]

true it does have its drawbacks with power loss from the compressor, but theres still a hell of a lot of cars out there runing ac still, so why not make the most of it and gain some extra cooling on your ic for little cost!

 

[MORF114]

Thought of this before , Its a good idea but i dont think its worth the hassle by keeping the topmount with the heat thats generated from a track day i dont think it would do much would be good for lower inlet temps for knock too and its not as if it would run out like a co2 spray bar or nos, i think you should try it but with a top mount i think it would heat the copper pipe before it cooled the rad maybe try something like a pwr barrel with it running through away from above the head where heat is rising.

How cold do these pipes get though ?

 

[Trip]

true it does have its drawbacks with power loss from the compressor, but theres still a hell of a lot of cars out there runing ac still, so why not make the most of it and gain some extra cooling on your ic for little cost!

Although one still retains the A/C system, I assume they do switch it off before racing.

 

[MORF114]

my old man sprayed co2 direct at his intercooler on a drag day with his oc and the cars ecu shit itself on the line wouldnt start for 10 mins, pissed myself laughing.

 

[Trip]

although C02 has good properties to cool stuff, it has another good property to kill oxygen. Thats why they use C02 to extinguish fires.

removing oxygen from the engine is very bad and it could be the case why the ECU wents nuts.

I saw ppl using a C02 fire extinguisher spraying it on the I/C with great success but while doing it they leave engine off.

 

[pulsarboby]

Although one still retains the A/C system, I assume they do switch it off before racing.

im not talking about my car, as i have removed it! but the ac pump will drain around 8-10bhp whilst switched on, which isnt a great deal in terms of everyday use.

but with say a topmount stuck in traffic on a road car, your turbo will start to bog down on acceleration. now couple this with the fact that it could well be a warm day and you may already be sitting in traffic with your ac switched on, so why not kill 2 birds with one stone and cool your ic at the same time, which will give you better engine response when you start rolling again.

my theory would have been to run the piping around the cooler then lag it afterwards with say a thermal blanket or similar which will keep all that ice cold air wrapped round your intercooler.

now what you need to work out is if your racing the car, would the 8-10bhp loss by running the pump be a loss or gain in the overall picture????

imo the response you will get from ice cold ic on a warm day when racing with high engine and ambient temps, will be far more beneficial in terms of turbo response and overall performance than the bhp you lose from running the pump!

 

[Trip]

im not talking about my car, as i have removed it! but the ac pump will drain around 8-10bhp whilst switched on, which isnt a great deal in terms of everyday use.

but with say a topmount stuck in traffic on a road car, your turbo will start to bog down on acceleration. now couple this with the fact that it could well be a warm day and you may already be sitting in traffic with your ac switched on, so why not kill 2 birds with one stone and cool your ic at the same time, which will give you better engine response when you start rolling again.

my theory would have been to run the piping around the cooler then lag it afterwards with say a thermal blanket or similar which will keep all that ice cold air wrapped round your intercooler.

now what you need to work out is if your racing the car, would the 8-10bhp loss by running the pump be a loss or gain in the overall picture????

imo the response you will get from ice cold ic on a warm day when racing with high engine and ambient temps, will be far more beneficial in terms of turbo response and overall performance than the bhp you lose from running the pump!

Yes agreed. If you have the system already in place i can see it from a point of killing two birds with one stone and it would make sense for example to switch the A/C on before a drag race and turn it off on the line.
In my case, car in not street legal and will be only used for races (not 1/4miles). Apart from robbing me bhp it will also increase my weight. :sad:

 

[pulsarboby]

yeah but so will a good p1ss up the night before, with a couple of burgers thrown in lol

 

[Keira]

my theory would have been to run the piping around the cooler then lag it afterwards with say a thermal blanket or similar which will keep all that ice cold air wrapped round your intercooler.

you need air to flow through the intercooler for it to work, by wrapping it you are preventing that, it'll be cold on the surface for about 3 seconds :lol: until you actually put some heat through the core.

i'd expect it to go bang, due to excessive charge temps quite quickly.

the charge cooler works by having water pumped through it, which takes away the heat, ice box works as its at freezing point and is used for one run before refilling, or like the chargecooler has a pump to circulate water,

this is a dumb idea tbh :lol:

 

[Trip]

there is an estimate turbo calc online
http://www.turbofast.com.au/tfcalc.html

I played around with the figures using water/air setup and the difference was 15bhp between a having water running in the system at ambient temp Vs water running in the system at 0C.

These calc do not reflect real life figures but they do have a small bearing to calculate approx figures.

 

[Trip]

 

[pulsarboby]

you need air to flow through the intercooler for it to work, by wrapping it you are preventing that, it'll be cold on the surface for about 3 seconds :lol: until you actually put some heat through the core.

i'd expect it to go bang, due to excessive charge temps quite quickly.

the charge cooler works by having water pumped through it, which takes away the heat, ice box works as its at freezing point and is used for one run before refilling, or like the chargecooler has a pump to circulate water,

this is a dumb idea tbh :lol:

ok blunt but fair:lol: :lol: didnt realise the charge temps, would'nt be kept down by the constant cooling of the micro bore pipe!

so basically a charge cooler works by having water constantly pumped round the system
like a marinised inlet manifold on a boat, is that correct?
if so where does the cool water supply come from? and obviously it still needs pumping and cooling to keep charge temps down!

 

[Trip]

ok blunt but fair:lol: :lol: didnt realise the charge temps, would'nt be kept down by the constant cooling of the micro bore pipe!

so basically a charge cooler works by having water constantly pumped round the system
like a marinised inlet manifold on a boat, is that correct?
if so where does the cool water supply come from? and obviously it still needs pumping and cooling to keep charge temps down!

Practically it does work like a marine system. But on the sea you have access to fresh/cool water all the time. On a road vehicle, you would need a pre-Radiator to cool the water.

 

[Trip]

 

[pulsarboby]

but would this not suffer the same fate as any other rad cooled system? as you are relying on cooled air to the radiator to keep the coolant cool!
if your stuck in traffic on a hot day then theres no air circulating, or do you run a seperate kenlowe fan to keep it cool all the time, which would need to run constantly on a hot day?

 

[Keira]

seperate fan if you want one and the fact that when your not on boost theres no heat going through the core anyway so sitting in traffic isn't going to heat the water up, remember, the water is taking the heat out of the intake air, then that water is cooled by the pre-rad

 

[pulsarboby]

i see! il scupper that cunning plan then lol
was just a thought anyway.

 

[Odin]

Here you go bobby a charge cooler and the front mounted pre rad with it's own fan.

Rob