Clutch problem diagnosis?

PobodY

Moderators
Staff member
I've been on the other site, but I wanted a second opinion from you guys before I start trying to drop the box (or paying someone to drop it for me).

Here's the history:
Recently I had problems with the clutch slipping, and I diagnosed it as the clutch slave cylinder. So I put a new one in, bled through some DOT 4, and went about my business.
About a week ago I started noticing a squeaky noise from the front left of the car. I figured that something had come loose; maybe the hub nut again, maybe one of my wishbone bolts (one of which has recently been helicoiled), maybe even the CV joint had lost its grease - it was still driving and I knew the wishbone etc was good because I'd recently replaced it.
I let my wife have the car for the day, and as she was driving home she stopped at the lights... clutch in. When suddenly the gears engaged and the car started hopping forward. She couldn't get it out of gear, so pulled off the road and called a flatbed truck. With the engine off it came out of gear. - I figure the plate can't have gone or she'd have gone nowhere instead of the car lurching with the clutch pedal still in.
I've flushed the hydraulics, and can see the slave cylinder push the fork. - I've been in the footwell and it's all dry, and there's a pedal support bracket installed (I can't see any bent or broken parts from there). The hose is old looking, but with no obvious damage or leaks from it.
I've adjusted all the freeplay out of the pedal (until you couldn't push the slave cylinder back into the housing)... then put a bit back in. - What a job!
I can't see much of the fork because I can't get the boot off without destroying it, but I shined a torch down the hole and can't see anything. I put a screwdriver down and it feels straight for about 15cm then it hits something (I figured that was the fork part).
With the engine running it feels like trying to select a gear against a steel plate (except reverse which sounds like gears grinding if you try to select it) - there's no noise, just very firm resistance. With the engine off the gearstick will go into all of them... except maybe reverse.

My theory is therefore that the release bearing has collapsed, and can't disengage the clutch. Does that sound right? I can't move the fork at all by hand (except back towards the cylinder when there's a bit of freeplay in the hydraulics), but that doesn't mean I can rule it out does it?

If there's any possible way it could be something that doesn't require me taking the box out, could someone tell me now?
Failing that, what's my next step? Should I start buying a release bearing, or do I need to get the clutch out to see what the real problem is (like the RB gearbox has died)?
I'm concerned that this is going to be beyond my abilities as I don't have a trolley jack, and I've only got axle stands... but I don't know if I can afford a mortgage to get a garage to look at it.
 
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geoff pine

Well-Known Member
You need to take the rubber boot of and have a look at whats going on when you try to operate the clutch and rent a house with a garage next time you move .
 

PobodY

Moderators
Staff member
You know, a house with a garage was pretty high on my list... it just didn't pan-out before we had to move.
I'll get that boot off tomorrow and take a good look - hopefully I'll be able to see what's what and order the right parts... then it'll be clutch in and out in the same day (with luck).
 

Fast Guy

Moderators
Staff member
Sounds like the fork may have gone. What clutch do you have fitted?
Fork or release bearing, it's box off.
 

PobodY

Moderators
Staff member
It's a Nismo paddle clutch - I'm not sure exactly how hold it is, but it can't be that long ago because the previous owner had it installed. He said it was a "twin paddle" but I assume that refers to the pucks on the plate and not that it has twin plates... I think someone went a little crazy at the Nismo store because it has a Nismo catback exhaust too (rotting at the back box naturally).

As long as it's not the input shaft on the gearbox... I'll take Geoff's advice and see if I can't take a really good look when it stops raining today.

I love my R, but sometimes I wonder if buying it was a wise decission. In my defence, I didn't count on my wife being unemployed quite this long.
 
R

riske

Guest
hmm seems to me as thou the thing giving you the most amount of problems is the wife... lol only playing. As said before its sounding like the fork. happened to me and im still off the road waiting for it to be fixed! Do you not have a run around car that you can use whilst saving for the box out job? Hope all goes well matey
 

johnsy

Active Member
i feel for ya fella ,me and the missus got made redundant last year , we both got jobs straight away only the money aint that good , well not good enough to run 2 cars and a mortgage lol iv just garaged mine and slowly getting all the little niggles sorted out so its good to go for atleast another 10 year hopefully the economy will have picked up by this time next year ,and, there'll be more jobs available ,

iv just had an osgiken clutch fitted and a few seals changed plus a drive shaft ,air con removal in cluding the rad, know im looking to get my arches and sill's sorted.
here's to another 6 month in the garage till iv saved enough penny's
 

PobodY

Moderators
Staff member
bob the builder from the modifiers site popped around to take a look at it with me today.
I got the boot off the fork, and it looks straight to me... and I can't see anywhere that the pivot may have gone through it.
There's a crapload of play in it though... like it's just resting ontop of a shaft. Obviously you can't see that much with a torch and your head under the bonnet, but I'm pretty confident that the bearing has gone.

So, will any release bearing for a Nissan do? I've seen them selling at £50 for Nissan, or £25 from driftworks, but will one from a 200sx fit?
EDIT: Looking at the part numbers (30502-0W720)the same bearing (30502) is used in quite a few cars, but maybe a different carrier (30514) - I think the 180SX/200SX part would fit.
Is there such a thing as an uprated bearing, or am I wasting my money chasing one?
I've been looking at Kieron's thread on how to get the clutch out without removing the engine, but Bob still thinks it'd be best to drop the engine and gearbox then split it.

I don't blame the wife, it could have been me. I did wonder if I shouldn't have let her drive it at full boost... but I don't think that's what caused the bearing to go.
 
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geoff pine

Well-Known Member
I have just split my transfer box from the the gear box with the engine out its not a job i would like to do with the engine in .
 

PobodY

Moderators
Staff member
Well... Geoff, Bob and I had the clutch out today.
I'm pleased to say that the release bearing seems fine... the plate on the other hand is completely f*cked, and it was a piece of the friction material that had ripped off the plate, and was stuck behind the fingers that was stopping it from coming off.

So looks like I need a new clutch now... Helix Organic? Exedy stage 1?

To add insult to injury, I can now tell why my 'Nismo twin paddle clutch' was so easy to live with... it's just a standard organic clutch.
 

vss irvine

Well-Known Member
its amazing how many people are told they have a fancy clutch when its actually standard!

your not alone in this one george!

both helix and exedy are good, exedy is cheaper though.

and ebay is normally cheapest place to get it.
 

PobodY

Moderators
Staff member
I was too late... but I found this place selling them at £303.50
Mr Steve isn't very complimentary about Exedy, but they are everywhere... and much cheaper than the Helix. That makes them very tempting.

If I can get the Helix for not much more, I think I'll have found the winning combination.
 
Cant fault the helix matey, had both the paddle and organic on the old one, and for everyday use it would have to be the organic.

On the new pulsar it has a nismotek clutch, which is basically an identiclt helix, with the uprated cover.
When swapping the engine over it is still in almost new condition and thats after 35000 miles of use too.
 

PobodY

Moderators
Staff member
I've convinced the wife that it's worth the extra to buy the Helix... looking at the old clutch it was an Exedy... and it must have been organic to produce all those fibres... but basically the friction pad came off the plate. Not convincing me to buy a replacement if that's what happens with them!
 
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