boooooooost

A

Anonymous

Guest
I think you really need to understand why you break pistons when you turn the boost up. I think a lot of you believe that it's because the increase in pressure is too much for the engine to cope with. This isn't the case at all. 9 times out of 10 when you kill an otherwise standard engine by running 1.4 bar boost, its because you've run the engine lean which has lead to very serious detonation and / or melted piston crowns.

If you actually inspect a piston that's blown either from failed ring lands or a melted crown, you will see that on the crown itself there are lots of tiny pits. These pits are a classic sign that detonation has been happening for some time.

Standard pistons will not break under high boost if the engine tune is ok, you could happily run 20psi all day long if you don't run lean or knock. It's also worth remembering that forged pistons aren't indestructable either. So if you kill a set of standard pistons and drop some forged ones in without first fixing the problem that caused detonation in the first place, then engine will blow again. Also detonation doesn't just crack pistons, it will bend rods, hammer flat spots in rod bearings and the crank, and it's also what causes head gaskets to blow.

If you want to run 1.4 bar boost then to be safe you will want to run an AFR of around 11.5 - 11.8:1. Standard injectors have enough fuel to safely run 15 - 16psi of boost (at 7300rpm) without maxing them out. They will supply more fuel if you ask them too, but you'll run them around 90 - 100% duty which not only is bad for the injector, but also gives you no safety margin for cold days or boost creep. If you run leaner than 12.5:1 at 1.4 bar boost, your cylinder temps will rise very quickly and the engine will start to detonate, then when that happens its just a matter of time before you break something.

So in short, standard pistons are fine for high boost on a tuned engine and will not fall apart because you've added an extra 10psi pressure on the already extreme pressures of combustion.

Forged pistons are not indestructable, they can just take a little bit more punishment that standard pistons. Fitting these however just means you've move the damage from detonation on to the cylinder walls and rod bearings.
 

Keira

New Member
Ben said:
I think you really need to understand why you break pistons when you turn the boost up.
`

maybe i should've put disentegrate under det caused by the extra heat caused by higher boost.

As you say forged pistons aren't indestructable just more resistant to det although alot of people do assume that the minute you move over to forged pistons all your problems will be solved,

my point is that my car has held together for at least a year running at most 1.3 bar, i believe this is because of the water injection lowering in cylinder temps, the standard fuel map must be providing enough fuel at this boost level whether the injectors are close to maxing out or not.

How much further it could be pushed i dont know.

if i ever get round to it i'll get alan to get the wide band probe on the car and see whats happening af ratio wise, re-wire the avcr to show duty and have a better picure of whats what, obvioulsy an egt reading would be good.

Consensus of opinion says that 1 bar is the most you can safely run on a standard mapped engine but personnaly i think this is bollox. No one as far as i know, has ever really looked into how far you can safely go on the standard map, just everyone jumps on the 1 bar band wagon.

I've never seen anyone say the very limit of the standard engine on the standard fueling map is ( fill in the blanks )..............boost, and i discovered this by doing, this that and the other..
 
$

$ven

Guest
GINGA said:
Ash's car had a full engine rebuild with forged pistons etc running 1.4bar on standard ecu,injectors,turbo and topmount and produced 349bhp and 330ish torque iirc 8)
Did he still have the standard MAF aswell, 'cause I've been told the standard MAF reaches maximum flow-capacity around 320bhp. :?:
 
Top