Turbos for dummies?

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Danny S R

New Member
Hey all,

First I'd like to thank Steve (Donpulsar) for replying to all the emails i sent him recently about this! :D

Anyway my turbo is making some very funny noises and Steve thinks the bearings might be going, Sounds different on full boost, 1.3 bar, and twice on start up its sounded like its got something in the turbo!

So.....im lookin to replace it but not with a standard turbo as ill just be in the same situation again soon, im looking at a hybrid and after reading Jim_1979's post and speaking to hiteq im starting to undersatnd what a "hybrid" is: 360 degree bearing, slightly larger wheel and cut back blades?

BUT which is the best one?! Ive asked hiteq theirs is £550 plus vat, as is Turbotechnics. Also spoke to AET and they said...

"Dear Dan

We can either supply a stage 2 GTIR turbo, which has left handed shaft, 360% thrust bearing, up rated normal bearings and total seal turbine seal, cost £ 720.00 + vat +P&P. Or supply a GT28 ball bearing turbo Capable of 400+bhp( anything up to 2.1bar of boost ), cost £910.00 +vat +P&P."

Now im not gonna run more than 1.3 bar (i say, i was supposed to stay at 1 bar... :lol: ) so i dont want a monster nor do i wanna spend more than bout £700 quid. Has anyone opinions on the above or any alternatives?

Thanks i have searched tuning AND buying & selling just to get an idea as much as i can, but i dont wanna be blowing my wad without thinking im 100% in the know! (Im running and SAFC2 and Profec B so im set to control everything.)

Dan! :D

PS: Now this puzzles me how can you run more power on a different turbo when your running the same amount of boost? surely if its same boost the same amount of air is going through the inlet manifold etc? (Told you this was for dummies :lol: )
 
J

justin666

Guest
Isnt it also down to efficiency aswell..?????

I run the turbo technics hybrid with 360 thrust and cliped blades. Not a bad little tubby altho looking back, When I got it a couple of years ago I could have got a much better spec'd GT28 Ballbaring unit from ATP for about the same money.. Live and learn :doh: :doh: :doh:

J.
 
A

AJ4

Guest
'boost' is a pretty vague concept. Its only a measure of the stacked up air thats not getting into the cylinders on time. Its also a function of airflow and temperature. If you increase the inlet temperature ( running a turbo outside its efficiency range ) then boost will go up but power will go down. If you open the inlet valve for longer, boost will go down and power will go up. The reason one turbo can produce more power for the same 'boost' as suggested above is because its more efficient and the air it expels is cooler.

theres no point running a turbo thats capable of 2.1 bar if you only want to run it at 1.3 bar, it will be laggy as hell and very innefficient. Choose one that suits the power you need and no more.
 
D

Danny S R

New Member
D-Fens thanks for that explanation, makes it clear now, so the air is cooler/denser etc as the turbo is not working as hard.

Justin 666 i emailed atp and they said.....

"Dan,

GT28RS would be nice for it.

GT2871R would be for 1.5 bar and beyond.

Either turbo is $1200 to your door via fedex and can be there in two days.

Thanks!"

and ChrisS, hey again, hows your red rocket running? :D where is that from?? Is a rollerbearing above or below the spec of a hybrid?

Thanks again
 
C

ChrisS

New Member
Danny S R said:
D-Fens thanks for that explanation, makes it clear now, so the air is cooler/denser etc as the turbo is not working as hard.

Justin 666 i emailed atp and they said.....

"Dan,

GT28RS would be nice for it.

GT2871R would be for 1.5 bar and beyond.

Either turbo is $1200 to your door via fedex and can be there in two days.

Thanks!"

and ChrisS, hey again, hows your red rocket running? :D where is that from?? Is a rollerbearing above or below the spec of a hybrid?

Thanks again
Click to expand...
Running well thanks mate. Its a t28 with the roller bearing core. straight replacement and spool up should be v.quick. Standard housings and wheel sizes, so probably wont flow quite as much.

http://www.apexperformance.co.uk/ca...33&PHPSESSID=a0a01ada46288083ce6c7bf0077d70ba
 
Y

youngsyp

New Member
ChrisS said:
Its a t28 with the roller bearing core. straight replacement and spool up should be v.quick. Standard housings and wheel sizes, so probably wont flow quite as much.

http://www.apexperformance.co.uk/ca...33&PHPSESSID=a0a01ada46288083ce6c7bf0077d70ba
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Aren't the 200SX turbos, of a slightly different spec to the GTiR turbos ?!

I've mailed Apex for the specs of the turbo so, I'll post them up when I get them !

That ATP price is pretty good, around £675 infact ! Although, you may have to add customs duty (@3% iirc) and VAT, if you're unlucky ?!
 
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ChrisS

New Member
youngsyp said:
Aren't the 200SX turbos, of a slightly different spec to the GTiR turbos ?!

I've mailed Apex for the specs of the turbo so, I'll post them up when I get them !

That ATP price is pretty good, around £675 infact ! Although, you may have to add customs duty (@3% iirc) and VAT, if you're unlucky ?!
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The t28 is an upgrade for the 200sx. They run a smaller turbo as standard.
 
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ChrisS

New Member
youngsyp said:
Only on the S13 iirc. On the s14> they run a T28 with different spec to the GTiR unit ?!
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Cant remember off hand, but thought they were both on t25's. The s13 definatly. Might be wrong about the s14. Im sure someone will know for sure.
 
fubar andy

fubar andy

Moderator & N/W Rep
Staff member
It is a T28 on the S14 (T25 on the CA18 ). I spoke to Bren (Apex) about a T28 upgrade from a S14, he said there was some modification involved but it should be ok.
 
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youngsyp

New Member
fubar andy said:
It is a T28 on the S14 (T25 on the CA18 ). I spoke to Bren (Apex) about a T28 upgrade from a S14, he said there was some modification involved but it should be ok.
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This is the response I got from Apex, when asking for specs for the roller bearing T28 turbo and whether it compares to the T28 on the GTiR !

Response from Ann at Apex: "This will not fit on to the GTiR, it is designed to fit the 200SX and althought the engine codes are the same, the parts are different. The manifold is different on the two cars."

Still not a straight forward swap though !
 
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C

ChrisS

New Member
youngsyp said:
This is the response I got from Apex, when asking for specs for the roller bearing T28 turbo and whether it compares to the T28 on the GTiR !

Response from Ann at Apex: "This will not fit on to the GTiR, it is designed to fit the 200SX and althought the engine codes are the same, the parts are different. The manifold is different on the two cars."

Still not a straight forward swap though !
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I cant understand why they would say its not a straight swap. The manifolds are different but the external packaging of a t28 turbo is the same regardless. The turbo is mounted in a slightly different position by the manifold, but there shouldnt be any difference in the actuator mounting or anything else that would stop it fitting? The 200sx guys fit turbos off the gtir straight on as far as i know, so there shouldnt be any reason the turbo shouldnt fit?

Ive not seen the 2 side by side but that would be my thoughts. Im sure rishi or someone would be able to give a definative answer.
 
Y

youngsyp

New Member
ChrisS said:
I cant understand why they would say its not a straight swap. The manifolds are different but the external packaging of a t28 turbo is the same regardless. The turbo is mounted in a slightly different position by the manifold, but there shouldnt be any difference in the actuator mounting or anything else that would stop it fitting? The 200sx guys fit turbos off the gtir straight on as far as i know, so there shouldnt be any reason the turbo shouldnt fit?

Ive not seen the 2 side by side but that would be my thoughts. Im sure rishi or someone would be able to give a definative answer.
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I agree with the point that it should be a straight forward swap, I thought that too. I just thought the internals of the T28 were slightly different on the 2 cars and that the one on the GTiR could make more power. Seems not to be the case ?!
 
C

ChrisS

New Member
youngsyp said:
I agree with the point that it should be a straight forward swap, I thought that too. I just thought the internals of the T28 were slightly different on the 2 cars and that the one on the GTiR could make more power. Seems not to be the case ?!
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Here we go...

S14 SR20DET: T-28, 60 trim 60 mm BCI-1 compressor in T-04B housing,
62 trim 53.8mm T-25 turbine. .64 A/R turbine housing. Ball bearing center section.

S15 SR20DET: T-28, 60 trim 60 mm BCI-1 compressor in T-04B housing with Inco turbine wheel, cast divider wall between turbine discharge and wastegate. Ball bearing center section.

Pulsar GTi-R: T-28, 60 trim 60 mm BCI-1 compressor in standard T-3 housing. 79 trim 53.8mm Inco T-250 turbine wheel .86 A/R turbine housing. Journal bearings.


The GT 28R is 60mm 60 trim 0.6A/R compressor with 62 trim 0.64 a/r turbine
 
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youngsyp

New Member
ChrisS said:
Pulsar GTi-R: T-28, 60 trim 60 mm BCI-1 compressor in standard T-3 housing. 79 trim 53.8mm Inco T-250 turbine wheel .86 A/R turbine housing. Journal bearings.


The GT 28R is 60mm 60 trim 0.6A/R compressor with 62 trim 0.64 a/r turbine
Click to expand...
Good info !

But, with the spec of the GT28R, apart from the roller bearing core, what other benefits does it have over the GTiR T28 ?
 
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