500bhp & torque query?

[Bream]

I'm considering buying a GTiR but I need some help in answering some question I have, if you'd be so kind

What proven spec of engine components and turbo would reliably provide 500bhp and similar torque with a GTiR engine?

I've heard the GTiR gearbox and transmission can't cope with this type of power, is this true?

What would I need modify gearbox and transmission wise to make it deal with 500 day in day out?

I've also heard the GTiR front end is nose heavy and effects the handling badly, is this correct? And what suspension options are there to help?

If I buy/build a GTiR I'll be sprint racing it and prob back at TOTB4, so I'll need a bullet proof car to last the year 8)

Cheers,

Jeff

 

[nismoboy]

JUN or HKS internals
hks 3037 tubby
quaife gearset and an osgilken clutch
and a set of coilovers and all the whiteline bits

Job done 500bhp all day long

 

[LeeSmith]

I've heard the GTiR gearbox and transmission can't cope with this type of power, is this true?

Yes mate the gearbox is the main problem, it can't cope with anything really above 350BHP (some oeple are getting away with it on 400bhp though.)

What would I need modify gearbox and transmission wise to make it deal with 500 day in day out?

Best upgrading to the Quaiffe Gearset.

I've also heard the GTiR front end is nose heavy and effects the handling badly, is this correct? And what suspension options are there to help?

Get the whiteline handling kit, sorts out the bumpsteer and stops the understeer, I'm not sure on actual suspension as i'm still on standard setup, it's something i have never looked at.

I hope it answers some of the questions.

 

[kyepan]

http://forum.gtiroc.com/phpbb2/viewforum.php?f=49 salvation lies within..

all your questions should be answered in the tuning faq section.

 

[skiddusmarkus]

Jeff-I've seen your Evo at ADR Motorsport and my car has just had an engine&gearbox rebuild there,pretty much every suspension add on you can get and LSD's front,centre and rear.If you want a ride in it then give them a bell and see if Rich will take you out in it as I'm going on holiday and have left it in their care.That way you get to see if it's worth spending all the dosh in the first place.
It's not 500bhp but will be capapble of 400+bhp when run in so will give you an idea of what to expect.
You'll also get to have a go in it before I do .

 

[Fast Guy]

What proven spec of engine components and turbo would reliably provide 500bhp and similar torque with a GTiR engine?

Apart from maybe Ivan in Australia, I don't think anyone has a proven 500bhp+ that they use on a daily basis. 500+ in a 1220kg Gtir would be a 10sec car and there ain't any......yet
As for the reliability issue, you could well be the guinea pig
If you're looking at buying a claimed one, get it proved as I doubt it will be. If you're thinking of building one, maybe speak to Simon Norris as he may have built one :?

 

[robinsongtir]

defintely get the front centre and rear diffs sorted If you find them somewhere in japan would get a full set of Nismo items especially for the front as it is still an open viscous item.
Turbo wise would use a HKS3037s or a Garret GT30 turbo.Engine if you want to go for a high revving engine get some forged pistons and a set of billet rods made from Crower.If your going for a stroker get the tomei 2.2 kit quite cheap as well will still be able to rev high and better spoolup as well.Then there is suspension as mentioned whiteline works kit powerflex do all the other bushes not in the whiteline,braces there are front and back uppers and rear lower available then there are afew rollcages do a search plenty.Brakes got to be some AP 6 pots under some 16's etc etc
Gearbox what do you want a syncro or dogbox or half dogbox there are two or three makes available quaiffe for syncro boxes PAR for syncro and 1/2 dogboxes sellholm in Sweden for dogboxes and another company in OZ that do dogboxes and syncros.Clutch there is only really one make available for a twin plate and that is OS giken go for the R2CD stronger one

 

[Bream]

Thanks for all your replies, I had looked through the FAQs section but it seemed limited on answer all my questions.

Many thanks to Skids who's car I will be driving to Sweden at the weekend thanks to his kind offer :shock: :lol: More seriously, I might just take up that offer in the new year before spending any money.

I'm just looking at the possibility of building a car capable of winning all sprint events and TOTB4 handling on a budget. My honest answer is no but you never know, so far the list stacks up like this:

£3500 for this car: http://forum.gtiroc.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=27087

Stick on this turbo for 2.5k: http://forum.gtiroc.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=27321

fit a quaife gearbox for 2k

Say another 2k for odds and sods.

Mapped by my good friend Sam 'The Dentist'!

=£10k for a reasonable well sorted GTiR.......

Doesn't it :?:

 

[robinsongtir]

yes should do there is the brakes and other bits and bobs to sort out.
What ECU you gonna use ?
other than that is pretty much ready to go.

 

[Bream]

What ECU you gonna use ?

Not sure abot ECU, what are regarded as the best value for money?

 

[skiddusmarkus]

Most people stick to the Power FC as they are a good compromise of price/power.A couple have Motec but you know how much they cost.

 

[Odin]

10k you'ed be lucky matey .

2.2 kit £2500
building and machineing £1500-2000
£3000 for quaife once built.
£1000 for a good clutch.
£1600 for Ap's
at least £2000 for a GOOD ECU fitted and set up.(mine was £2700)
about £2000 to sort the susp.
another £2000 for dif's fitted.

Then you have thing's like intercooler's/airfilter/better rad/oilcooler/breather system, and there's prob a load I can't think of at the moment.

but good luck fella


rob

 

[Bream]

Very true, as I know from bitter experience you need more than luck when building a car

But at least I'm in the trade, so to say and have contacts for spannering and mapping. Should save me a few quid here and there

The other option of course it to buy something near what I want and then just convert it, for 8k this seems pretty well sorted: http://forum.gtiroc.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=26816

 

[sam_elassar]

never would have thought that i would meet you here jeff , so i thought i will do my first post.


i think the gti-r will be a great car to convert for sprints and TOTB however there is few things that would need to be changed in your list. first is obviously the suspension. the last couple of gti-r i have mapped ( very quick cars) feel very scary at high speed :shock: so a good suspension set up and some aerodynamics wont go a miss. the other things you can strip it down it even lighter, the bonnet for example is very heavy but that is your speciality


turbos

i would avoid the turbo on the link and probably stick with a new age turbo, you can get a custom manifold with T3 flange then it will be criminal not to fit a 3071r 0.63 exhuast housing on it. you will get full boost before 4000revs and over 450bhp all day long if the engine can take it. i hvae seen the manifold and looks very well made, a guy called Rishigtir on here has it. lets face it jeff you are not used to lag


ecu
power fc, or power fc pro are nice and cheap, ZX300 maf sensor, 700cc injectors and we are ready to go really.

you get gems, but the ecu has not had any development on it for 10years or so, so would not really go there but i can get you one if you want as usual.

motec also do an ecu for the gtir but i have not mapped one yet, but i think i have got one lined up for the next couple of months.


sam
merry christmas

 

[skiddusmarkus]

Weight is about the only thing going for the GTiR against Evos&Imprezas,which are pretty much going to be your main opposition in sprinting and TOTB.You can strip a lot of weight out of an already light car if you don't mind having a bare shell inside and lose a few luxuries.I've stripped about 80kg out of mine by removing the stereo and speakers,all the interior,aircon,sound deadening and swapping the seats for lighter ones(not in yet though).Check the stickies above for a list of how much stuff weighs that Nad painstakingly did peice by peice .

Even with all the money suspension work I've had done I still wouldn't fancy it's chances against an Evo with the same mods/driver.

As for turbos,if you weren't aiming so high powerwise you'd be able to use the standard cast manifold and have the choice of some smaller turbos which won't need relocating and give excellent spoolup.


Sam-welcome to the site ,there's a thread about Power FC mapping in this forum that I'm sure Ginga would love you to read and comment on.

http://forum.gtiroc.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=27139

 

[robinsongtir]

Jasons car is well sorted and he has owned it for a long time very solid.If you stick with a 2litre engine I wouldn't bother changing rods they are plenty strong enough as standard have been proven on a friends car up to 2.3bar and 8000rpm.all you will need is a set of forged pistons 87mm and metal headgasket I would say and then the head sorting as std the cams in a gtir are only really low lift and short duration you need to sort this out to get good torque.

 

[GINGA]

rebuilt engine with
forged pistons
uprated rods
knife edged crank
fully balanced etc
Fully ported head with manifold matched to head or single throttle body conversion
270 uprated cams,pullies, springs etc
rocker stopper kit
£3-5k ish

Hks 3037s or Garrett GT30 or GT35
Manifold to suit
external gate
3" turbo back custum exhaust
£2.5-3k

Power fc pro or autronics etc
sard 740cc injectors
uprated fpr with slighty raised fuel pressure if required
Intank fuel pump or 2 to be on the safe side or twin pump and swirl pot setup
Z32/Q45 maf (not with autronics)
£1-1.5k

Large fmic setup with nice smooth mandral bent pipe work
£350-£1k

Twin plate clutch
£800ish

Quaife gearset fitted
£3k

Lsd front diff
reworked centre/rear diff :?:
£1.5k

Serious brake setup
£2k ish

Serious suspension set up
£2-3k

other stuff
Engine and gearbox oil coolers
spark plugs, uprated coil etc
Uprated rad and hoses
Heat lagging etc
£1-1.5k

Wouldn't bother trying to win anything against the skylines,evo's and scoobs though as there just better set out cars than the gtir you'll probably end up spending considerably more on the gtir just to get it close to the same level as the others

 

[Keira]

Wouldn't bother trying to win anything against the skylines,evo's and scoobs though as there just better set out cars than the gtir you'll probably end up spending considerably more on the gtir just to get it close to the same level as the others

you beat me to it

with the pulsar theres far to much to do to get it handling half decently let alone better than the newer cars with their fancy electronic driver aiding gizmos .

its good fun trying but any of your evo driving mates will take great delight in telling you you're wasting your time :roll: :lol:

Imho the pulsar makes a very good project car as theres so much you need to improve that nissan never got as far as developing and it will certainly keep you busy 8)

 

[stuart rawlinson]

Very true, as I know from bitter experience you need more than luck when building a car

But at least I'm in the trade, so to say and have contacts for spannering and mapping. Should save me a few quid here and there

The other option of course it to buy something near what I want and then just convert it, for 8k this seems pretty well sorted: http://forum.gtiroc.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=26816

Or for 9K you can have mine
and it comes with 2.2, Motec M48 pro, big tubby, Quife box Os twin plate and the other 25k ive spent on it for FREE, and its done no more than 2500 miles on its rebuild

As i work away now it just sits here doing howt

Stu

 

[Keira]

if you'd have only said those words about 2months ago you'd be getting a phone call

for £9000 thats a f o o king bargain and i could have been just like edd and ruined it all by myself :lol: :lol: