Detonation question

akchang

New Member
how long does it take for detonation to occur when lower grade fuels are used? my car has been out of my hands during shipping and i know that there is some low grade fuel in the tank. (87 octane american) 90 RON. i will siphon it out of the tank but it is possible that it was driven on this fuel but only for less than a km. how damaging could this be. i am very worried as this is my dream car and getting one in the states has proven to be quite challenging.

thanks

ian

moving to regular maintenance/servicing, FAST GUY
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
It should be ok unless you start booting it. I would fill it right to the top with some decent fuel asap.
What octane rating is the juice over there? Do you have to use octane booster?

Andy
 
J

J-GTi-R

Guest
Less than a kilometer on that fuel? Even if it was det'ing, it wouldn't cause any real damage. The ECU retards the timing if it detects poor quality fuel (within limits of course), so it should be fine. Prolonged use of that fuel at full boost/revs would defionitely not be recommended, but for the distance and driving involved, I wouldn't worry.
 

Fast Guy

Moderators
Staff member
You could start detting as soon as the fuel hits the engine. If you are driving you might get some pinking as the first signs. That's a metallic rattling sound from the engine.
If a courier or whoever was driving was thrashing it, I'd just keep your fingers crossed.
Do a compression test to check the health of your engine if you're worried.
 

akchang

New Member
thanks for the help. i havent owned a car with this kind of performance and need for high octane fuel so i appreciate the feedback.
 
J

J-GTi-R

Guest
98 RON will be fine, pretty much what we all run over here.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Stop confusing Detination with pinking, they are two different things. If your car detinated (which our cars have a thing to try to stop) you would know. There would be a nice hole straight threw the piston. Pinking (not pinging) would result in a burned piston (over time).
You can control pinking (back off) as it happens under load, but not detination.
Use the fuel your car is tuned for, don't try to overcome a badly tuned car by using a higher octane fuel, won't work.
 

Fast Guy

Moderators
Staff member
bd581 said:
Use the fuel your car is tuned for, don't try to overcome a badly tuned car by using a higher octane fuel, won't work.

No one said it was a badly tuned car. It was the low grade fuel he was worried about, so in this case a higher octane fuel would work as it is the fuel the car was designed for. :wink:
 

Fast Guy

Moderators
Staff member
bd581 said:
Stop confusing Detination with pinking, they are two different things. If your car detinated (which our cars have a thing to try to stop) you would know. There would be a nice hole straight threw the piston. Pinking (not pinging) would result in a burned piston (over time).
You can control pinking (back off) as it happens under load, but not detination.
You are confusing them yourself :?

An engine can live with detonation occurring for considerable periods of time, relatively speaking. There are no engines that will live for any period of time when pre-ignition occurs. When people see broken ring lands they mistakenly blame it on pre-ignition and overlook the hammering from detonation that caused the problem. A hole in the middle of the piston, particularly a melted hole in the middle of a piston, is due to the extreme heat and pressure of pre-ignition.
Read the full article here, Link courtesy of Anders in another thread.

http://www.streetrodstuff.com/Articles/Engine/Detonation/index.php
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Hey "Fast Guy" No offence, but i'm right. Pinking is pre-ignition as you know, as is detonation. The two are very easily confused as they both have simular effects on a motor. The differance is Pinking is controlled, detonation isn't.
Pinking can be caused by a few things. Head gasket broken and a piece sitting in the cylinder, compression ratio too high for the grade of fuel being used, incorrect timing to name a few. Detonation, as the name suggests, is an explosion of the fuel. In an engine fuel DOES NOT explode like many think. The fuel burns, the heat of the air/fuel mix is what forces the piston down (compression) The differances in octane ratings is not how "explosive" the fuel is, its the burn rate.
Pinking usually happens when under load, so when it happens, back off. Detonation is random. As i said, GTi-Rs have a DET sensor, so unless its not working, the computer should do all the adjustments needed to stop this from happening.
Sorry about the long post, but i felt the need to defend myself. All this info was given to me by an engineer, not just a mechanic. He studies how engines work, the physics and chemistry behind it all. Then teaches it.
If you still don't agree with what i say, maybe we just have differant terms for it in Australia. But i seldom hear "detonation" used in Aus, but pinking or pinging often.
Besides this is getting too far away from the original question and probably confusing the poor guy.
Hopefully no hard feelings
 
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